Often the lawyer(s) for rape defendants, if the woman is or might be promiscuous, want to (try to, used to (I’m not familiar with the rape shield law)) suggest that that means she must have consented. I guess the bullshit argument is that she is insatiable and never says “no” (or maybe that she must been playing a game when she said “no” (I don’t know)), and/or that she is morally compromised. In any case, it’s ridiculous. In addition to all the other reasons to believe a rape survivor unless you have a REALLY, REALLY good reason not to, when it comes to a woman who is or might be promiscuous there’s this- why would a woman who likes frequent casual sex with men she doesn’t know (or is promiscuous to a lesser degree) falsely accuse a man of raping her? If it were more or less proven that she was lying, she would get a reputation and it would seriously lessen the odds of men propositioning her or agreeing to have sex with her.
Besides the fact that such a defense is offensive and probably coming from a lawyer with a guilty client, it just doesn’t make any sense.
(UPDATE 4/17/20 The more I think about it, even when the rape shield law doesn't work, this might not be an appropriate argument to make in court, but in arguments outside court, I still think this can be effective when some people don't believe a survivor who is or might be promiscuous.
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UPDATE 4/23/20 ALLEGATIONS AGAINST BIDEN
(UPDATE 5/25/20 A few weeks ago Biden did deny it personally. See this)
You should read this. It's about an allegation that Biden sexually assaulted a woman. An update with new evidence is here. More evidence is mentioned here.
**UPDATE 5/32/20 A lot of Biden supporters have been saying things that they normally wouldn't say about women who claim they were assaulted. These Biden supporters think that they can limit those comments to the Reade/Biden situation. But there are immature and/or just sexist men hearing and reading these comments, and they are influenced by them, and the next time they're asked to believe a survivor, they won't believe her **
I posted the following comment:
I don't know if this has already been said. I read the article but not the comments. We need to believe women who make these allegations and Dem politicians should not be seen as innocent because of how bad their oppoents are. I'm terrified of Trump winning- he is a fascist, as i explain at- https://theblackandthegreen2.blogspot.com/…/trump-doesnt-un… . But the way to defeat him isn't to throw sexual assault survivors under the bus. Metoo and others should launch a MAJOR campaign focusing on TRUMP assaulting women, and the other ways that Trump is a sexist and a campaign on how even though it's very likely Biden did something very bad (I need a good reason to not believe a woman who makes these allegations), he is in a lot of ways, a feminist to one degree or another.
WE CAN DEFEAT TRUMP WITHOUT THROWING SEXUAL ASSAULT SURVIVORS UNDER THE BUS!
(One thing I didn't address is the thorny issue of how this should be resolved. I simply refuse to throw this woman under the bus- if she's telling truth, he didn't [do something like] just touch her breast, he PENETRATED her. Maybe she and Biden can agree that if he admits it and apologizes, she won't press charges. I mean, she seems like a liberal-progressive dem, she must want Trump defeated as much as the rest of us)
If Biden is no longer a viable candidate, he should step aside for Warren.
1. If Bernie gets the nomination in a bizarre way, a LOT of Biden supporters will not do anything more than vote for him and many won't do that. He is too radical to get their support unless he had earned the nomination by winning primaries.
2. Many women will probably feel betrayed that the DP almost nominated an alleged or actual rapist.
3. She can more effectively attack Trump over COVID-19 because her brother (who did multiple tours in Vietnam) died from it recently.
4. She's progressive enough to get most of the Bernie supporters, but not so progressive that she'll scare off more than a few Biden supporters.
5. With a misogynist like Trump as the alternative, women will proabably vote for her in unprecedented numbers.
6. If Trump calls her "Pocahontas" and tries to pose as the anti-racist in the contest, that will back-fire massively- it will bring more attention than usual to his record on race. And he WILL call her Pocahontas.
7. She came to prominence by being placed in charge of overseeing Obama's response to the recession that started in 2008. She'd be perfect for guiding efforts to get the economy going after COVID-19 is over and we're in a depression.
UPDATE 4/30/20 Some more comments I left on Politico.
(One thing I didn't address is the thorny issue of how this should be resolved. I simply refuse to throw this woman under the bus- if she's telling truth, he didn't [do something like] just touch her breast, he PENETRATED her. Maybe she and Biden can agree that if he admits it and apologizes, she won't press charges. I mean, she seems like a liberal-progressive dem, she must want Trump defeated as much as the rest of us)
* * * *
UPDATE 4/26/20If Biden is no longer a viable candidate, he should step aside for Warren.
1. If Bernie gets the nomination in a bizarre way, a LOT of Biden supporters will not do anything more than vote for him and many won't do that. He is too radical to get their support unless he had earned the nomination by winning primaries.
2. Many women will probably feel betrayed that the DP almost nominated an alleged or actual rapist.
3. She can more effectively attack Trump over COVID-19 because her brother (who did multiple tours in Vietnam) died from it recently.
4. She's progressive enough to get most of the Bernie supporters, but not so progressive that she'll scare off more than a few Biden supporters.
5. With a misogynist like Trump as the alternative, women will proabably vote for her in unprecedented numbers.
6. If Trump calls her "Pocahontas" and tries to pose as the anti-racist in the contest, that will back-fire massively- it will bring more attention than usual to his record on race. And he WILL call her Pocahontas.
7. She came to prominence by being placed in charge of overseeing Obama's response to the recession that started in 2008. She'd be perfect for guiding efforts to get the economy going after COVID-19 is over and we're in a depression.
* * * *
UPDATE 4/30/20 Some more comments I left on Politico.
People need to watch some Law and Order: Special Victims Unit. There's not some category of man that is not capable of assault. What about accusations of racism of one sort of another directed towards white allies? Some white allies have made serious mistakes, and some have not admitted it. What about the Southern Poverty Law Center (which I generally like)? They have made some mistakes. And what about assault that falls short of rape? What Biden allegedly did isn't TONS worse than grabbing a boob- it'e very possible a politically feminist man could do that. And in the last week a fair amount of evidence has emegered that she IS telling the truth. What about believing a woman who makes such allegations unless you have a good reason to think she's lying? Do you know how difficult it must be for women to come forward about this? Maybe that's why she initailly didn't mention the assault. It must be easeir to to tell people you were inappropriately touched than it is to tell people you were penetrated. And as far as the amount of time that has passed, that happens too and you die-hard Biden supporters know that.
And what effect will this refusal to believe her have on other women who want to and need to come forward with allegations agaist powerful Dems or progressives?
And what about this lie about the NY Times clearing Biden? That's suspicious. They're desperate and that's probably because it's true. Also, his refusal to say it isn't true, that's also suspicious.
* * * *
UPDATE 5/2/20 When someone criticized me for leaning on a TV show, I wrote:
"This is almost as simplistic as what I said in that first comment above, but SVU is INCREDIBLY popular and Hargitay is incredibly popular, and what SVU says about sexual assault makes sense to me. And I love Ice-T for a lot of reasons. I have known some women who have been assaulted. I was exposed a little bit to Women's Studies. More of my thoughts about SVU are [here].
*********
"Biden won because he got the most votes. He shouldn't be replaced by one of the losers. We've heard Reade's shifting stories. She's lying."
And what effect will this refusal to believe her have on other women who want to and need to come forward with allegations agaist powerful Dems or progressives?
And what about this lie about the NY Times clearing Biden? That's suspicious. They're desperate and that's probably because it's true. Also, his refusal to say it isn't true, that's also suspicious.
* * * *
UPDATE 5/2/20 When someone criticized me for leaning on a TV show, I wrote:
"This is almost as simplistic as what I said in that first comment above, but SVU is INCREDIBLY popular and Hargitay is incredibly popular, and what SVU says about sexual assault makes sense to me. And I love Ice-T for a lot of reasons. I have known some women who have been assaulted. I was exposed a little bit to Women's Studies. More of my thoughts about SVU are [here].
*********
**(UPDATE 5/27/20 Facebook recently decided that many of my comments on Politico are spam, apparently because I was including the URL for this blog. So they are now visible only to me, although I am appealing and hopefully they'll be restored. I have thus deleted the names of the people I responded to and what they said. Think of the statements I am responding to as representative of what critics of Reade say)**
UPDATE 5/2/20 in a discussion below an article here, I had the following exchange, partly about my belief that Biden should stand aside for Warren
"Biden won because he got the most votes. He shouldn't be replaced by one of the losers. We've heard Reade's shifting stories. She's lying."
Tom Shelley There is good reason to believe she is telling the truth. Why would her mom call in to Larry King if Reade wasn't VERY upset and why would she be VERY upset if she was just touched inappropriately? It was recently reported that she DID tell some people years ago. Her story changed, I assume, because it must be difficult to say that you were assaulted.
These allegations wil drag down Biden's campaign. Trump supporters don't give a shit about sexual assault. Dems and progressives do.
Tom
UPDATE 5/9/20 There's an article here about how this is hurting other Dems.
Below an article here, I had the following exchange (that article also includes some more evidence that Reade is telling the truth). Based on the silhouette for his Facebook account, ***** is apparently male. (within minutes of updating this, there was another reply for me to reply to, by someone named ******)
Tom Shelley
I don't know how biden's campaign says that she's being inconsistent by adding details. That happens. She said, accoridng to the article "I wasn’t scared of him, that he was going to take me in a room or anything. It wasn’t that kind of vibe." How is that in conflict with what she said earlier? More of my thoughts are at- https://theblackandthegreen2.blogspot.com/.../a-response... after the first few paragraphs.
Tom Shelley
https://theblackandthegreen2.blogspot.com/
* * *
"She said one thing and then added more"
* * *
Tom Shelley
Saying publicly that you were sexually assaulted cannot be easy for a woman in our society. It's easier to say you were harrassed. That would explain why she initially just reported the harrassment. But, if she's telling the truth, she then got the courage to report the assault.
Why would she lie? She's a progressive and wants Trump defeated. If she was a tool of the GOP, why has she refused offers to be interviewed on Fox?
Tom Shelley
* * *
"She is doing this because she supports Bernie Sanders"
* * *
Tom Shelley
Bernie supporters want Trump defeated. Bernie has endorsed Biden. Therefore it's reasonable to assume that she wouldn't harm Biden just because he defeated Bernie. If she's a die-hard Bernie supporter and she wasn't assaulted, she would follow Bernie's lead and endorse Biden. She is saying this stuff because it's true.
Tom
* * *
There's a difference between being scared for your physical safety and scared about political/vocational/personal retaliation for reporting a sexual assault
Tom
UPDATE 5/21/20 As far as the reports that she is incredibly unethical. Although (if they're true) it makes me a little open-minded that she is lying, consider this- A: unethical women get assaulted, just like ethical women do and B: maybe her experience being assaulted affected her behavior. Do people think that rapists do psychological profiles of their victims and only rape the ethical ones? IF they do such profiles, they would only rape the unethical ones because a lot of ass-holes like a lot of Biden supporters won't believe the woman.
****************
UPDATE 6/20/20 As I said above, it's possible for an otherwise feminist man to do something stupid and bad and what Biden allegedly did is not as bad as rape. I just watched a Season 20 episode of Law & Order: Special Victims Unit called "Hell's Kitchen." It's partly about an Assistant DA assigned to sex crimes who has a good reputation, but tried to rape a girl in High School and as an ADA covers for a friend of his who rapes women. Obviously that ADA character is not a mirror image of the kind of man Reade says Biden is, but still, it's possible for otherwise feminist men to do something stupid and bad.
These allegations wil drag down Biden's campaign. Trump supporters don't give a shit about sexual assault. Dems and progressives do.
Tom
* * * *
UPDATE 5/9/20 There's an article here about how this is hurting other Dems.
***************
UPDATE 5/9/20
**(UPDATE 5/27/20 Facebook recently decided that many of my comments on Politico are spam, apparently because I was including the URL for this blog. So they are now visible only to me, although I am appealing and hopefully they'll be restored. I have thus deleted the names of the people I responded to and what they said. Think of the statements I am responding to as representative of what critics of Reade say)**
Below an article here, I had the following exchange (that article also includes some more evidence that Reade is telling the truth). Based on the silhouette for his Facebook account, ***** is apparently male. (within minutes of updating this, there was another reply for me to reply to, by someone named ******)
Tom Shelley
I don't know how biden's campaign says that she's being inconsistent by adding details. That happens. She said, accoridng to the article "I wasn’t scared of him, that he was going to take me in a room or anything. It wasn’t that kind of vibe." How is that in conflict with what she said earlier? More of my thoughts are at- https://theblackandthegreen2.blogspot.com/.../a-response... after the first few paragraphs.
Tom Shelley
https://theblackandthegreen2.blogspot.com/
* * *
"She said one thing and then added more"
* * *
Tom Shelley
Saying publicly that you were sexually assaulted cannot be easy for a woman in our society. It's easier to say you were harrassed. That would explain why she initially just reported the harrassment. But, if she's telling the truth, she then got the courage to report the assault.
Why would she lie? She's a progressive and wants Trump defeated. If she was a tool of the GOP, why has she refused offers to be interviewed on Fox?
Tom Shelley
* * *
"She is doing this because she supports Bernie Sanders"
* * *
Tom Shelley
Bernie supporters want Trump defeated. Bernie has endorsed Biden. Therefore it's reasonable to assume that she wouldn't harm Biden just because he defeated Bernie. If she's a die-hard Bernie supporter and she wasn't assaulted, she would follow Bernie's lead and endorse Biden. She is saying this stuff because it's true.
Tom
* * *
"At one point she said she wasn't scared of him and at another point she said she was scared to file a sexual harassment complaint"
* * *
Tom
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UPDATE 5/21/20 As far as the reports that she is incredibly unethical. Although (if they're true) it makes me a little open-minded that she is lying, consider this- A: unethical women get assaulted, just like ethical women do and B: maybe her experience being assaulted affected her behavior. Do people think that rapists do psychological profiles of their victims and only rape the ethical ones? IF they do such profiles, they would only rape the unethical ones because a lot of ass-holes like a lot of Biden supporters won't believe the woman.
****************
UPDATE 6/20/20 As I said above, it's possible for an otherwise feminist man to do something stupid and bad and what Biden allegedly did is not as bad as rape. I just watched a Season 20 episode of Law & Order: Special Victims Unit called "Hell's Kitchen." It's partly about an Assistant DA assigned to sex crimes who has a good reputation, but tried to rape a girl in High School and as an ADA covers for a friend of his who rapes women. Obviously that ADA character is not a mirror image of the kind of man Reade says Biden is, but still, it's possible for otherwise feminist men to do something stupid and bad.
